Hello! This is The Vergecast, the flagship podcast of The Verge... and your life. Every Friday, Nilay Patel and Dieter Bohn make sense of the week's tech news with help from our wide-ranging staff. Join us every week for a fun, deeply nerdy, often off-the-rails conversation about what's happening now (and next) in technology and gadgets.
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Lessons from the very first chatbot
Before Alexa and Siri, there was ELIZA. The first chatbot ever was the creation of a man named Joseph Weizenbaum, who built the bot almost as a magic trick — and then couldn't believe how many people fell for it. David Berry and Mark Marino, two members of a team dedicated to restoring and understanding ELIZA, explain how Weizenbaum created the virtual conversant, why he came to regret it, and what ELIZA can teach us about life in the AI age. Further reading: Why your Amazon order confirmation emails have become so unhelpful David Ellison’s ready to pull Paramount out of California What to expect from Google’s 2026 Pixel hardware launch event The ELIZA Archaeology Project Inventing ELIZA: How the First Chatbot Shaped the Future of AI From Eliza to ChatGPT: the 60-year history of chatbots Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Pencils down: We share our vibe-coded websites
We've spent the last month vibe coding our own corners of the internet. The Verge's Jake Kastrenakes and Hayden Field join David to talk about their use of Gemini, Codex, and Claude Code to build 90s-themed personal websites, vegetable-sharing systems, and photo boards. It wasn't always easy, and we didn't get everything done, but with a little AI and a lot of prompting, we made it work. Further reading: Four takeaways from Mark Zuckerberg’s massive AI manifesto | The Verge The first rival Android app store just arrived in the US Play Store | The Verge Space mirrors could ruin astronomy — and your eyes | The Verge Claude has been having a moment — can it keep it up? | The Verge The vibe-coding AI future is both exciting and terrifying | The Verge Welcome to the personal software revolution | The Verge Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
What's behind the Google AI shakeup
Google underwent a big AI shakeup this week, leaving a lot of people wondering whether there are big problems on team Gemini. David and Nilay start the show by discussing what's next for Jeff Dean and Demis Hassabis, before diving into the ways in which Google and Reddit have become existentially, problematically dependent on one another. After that, we talk through Disney's plan to turn Disney Plus into an everything app, and all the reasons we think that's a terrible idea and a sign of big problems in the streaming biz. Finally, in the lightning round, Brendan Carr is still a dummy, Snapchat wants AI out of your feed, and BMW has a Spider-Man to sell you. Further reading: The messy politics behind Google’s big AI shakeup | The Verge Google just announced a major shakeup of its top AI leadership Google Assistant will disappear from your phone next month Can Reddit fend off a new wave of AI SEO spam? Reddit is introducing a new moderator: AI Reddit says it plans to “make changes” to old Reddit Bluesky CEO Toni Schneider wants to grow the platform and the protocol Disney says it’s ‘exploring’ adding a free tier to Disney Plus Disney gives TikTok creators official access to Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar characters Despite Spider-Man: Brand New Day’s success, the MCU is on shaky ground Disney Plus is about to go beyond streaming Paramount and WBD’s antitrust trial is set for March 2027 David Ellison promises he’s not going to ruin CNN. Almost half of HBO Max subscribers watch with ads. | The Verge Federal Communications Commission scraps limit on broadcast TV ownership SpaceX is barely Space and mostly X SpaceX is coming for T-Mobile, AT&T and Verizon BMW’s in-car Spider-Man ad is villain behavior X product chief Nikita Bier is leaving after one year | The Verge Snapchat will no longer recommend ‘wholly AI-generated videos’ in its vertical video feed Snap reports 971 million monthly active users ahead of its Specs launch event on September 16th Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. 0:00 Cold Open01:05 Google AI Shakeup Explained03:24 Gemini Product Mess05:29 Demis Hassabis and the AGI Split14:06 Is Google Actually Behind?15:29 AI Overviews Fail Parade18:12 Gemini Users and Distribution20:55 Google Plus Warning Signs24:14 Reddit as Search Lifeline27:35 AI Slop and Dead Internet29:32 Google Buys Reddit Theory33:51 Reddit Earnings Reality Check35:40 Smoking Community Vibes38:20 Disney Everything App44:25 Time Spent Arms Race47:39 Free Tier and Ads52:08 Paramount Warner Deal Drama01:00:23 Brendan Carr is a Dummy01:11:51 Nikita Bier Leaves X01:13:53 SpaceX Telecom Dreams01:20:15 Snapchat Versus AI Slop01:25:26 BMW In Car Ads01:31:19 Wrap And Subscribe Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
The next big thing in movies is 60-year-old IMAX tech
Christopher Nolan's The Odyssey is the first feature film ever shot entirely with IMAX 70mm film cameras, which is apparently a very big deal, and why it's been harder than usual to get a ticket to see Matt Damon. And now that Spider-Man is moving onto IMAX screens, it may be even harder to get a ticket. Why is this 60-year-old technology suddenly the hottest thing in movies? The Verge's film and TV reporter Charles Pulliam-Moore joins senior reviewer Jennifer Pattison Tuohy to compare the standard and IMAX versions of The Odyssey and talk us through the difference between IMAX, LieMAX, and Infinity Vision. Further reading: Christopher Nolan’s Odyssey will be the first movie shot entirely on IMAX film Don’t screw this up, Marvel The Odyssey turned me into an IMAX believer Google just announced a major shakeup of its top AI leadership Nintendo beats earnings thanks to US tariff refunds it won’t share with gamers Bose’s upgraded QuietComfort headphones add head-tracking immersive audio Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Hotline: E Ink, the fediverse, and smart Puka shells
You have questions. We have (some) answers! For this week's hotline episode, Travis Larchuk asks David your questions about E Ink screens, federated messaging, minimalist phones, AI wearables, and what we got wrong about wide foldables. And don't forget, you can always call 866-VERGE11 or email vergecast@theverge.com to get your questions in about anything and everything. Bonus points if it involves popping your two collars. Further reading: The Light Flip is a minimalist flip phone with a point to prove ‘Max Ink Mode’ is back on TCL’s NXTPaper 70 Pro Daylight DC-1 tablet hands-on: an Android tablet with a new kind of screen Samsung’s Galaxy Z Fold 8 feels like the future Disney says it’s ‘exploring’ adding a free tier to Disney Plus Disney Plus is about to go beyond streaming. Disney gives TikTok creators official access to Marvel, Star Wars, and Pixar characters SpaceX is coming for T-Mobile, AT&T and Verizon | The Verge Google Assistant will disappear from your phone next month Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
What's really open about open-weight AI?
Everyone in AI is talking about open-weight models right now. Some see them as the ticket to faster, more efficient development; others see them as an economic threat; they're either a security risk or the only security solution, depending who you ask. The Verge's Robert Hart explains how open-weight models work, why they're suddenly at the center of discussions about AI safety, and whether the only way to stop a bad guy with AI is a good guy with AI. Further reading: The next Xbox could play every Xbox game ever made Microsoft is bringing Xbox 360 games to PC Apple briefly yanked Telegram from the App Store over CSAM violations These trackable batteries could help you locate a missing camera OpenAI’s rogue AI agent didn’t stop at hacking Hugging Face We’re running out of reasons to ignore AI safety Anthropic says Claude accidentally hacked real companies too China’s Alibaba takes another swipe at America’s AI supremacy OpenAI’s biggest threat may just be open AI Nvidia, Microsoft launch open AI security alliance — without OpenAI, Google, or Anthropic Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Rise of the Whoop dupes
For the last few years, the trend in wearables has been all about screens. As many of them as possible. But now, companies like Whoop, Fitbit, and Garmin are creating new products that ditch the display entirely. The Verge's Victoria Song explains why no-screen is the new flex, why even the most quantified athletes might not want a display on their wrist, and whether Whoop and the Whoop Dupes are a sign of a broader trend Further reading: Spider-Man and The Odyssey are splitting up IMAX screens after a record-breaking weekend) Truth Social’s priority access subscription goes live and raises corruption concerns. | The Verge Google’s Pixel 11 specs and price leak showing the impact of RAMageddon | The Verge Lenovo Googlebook leaks reveal a laptop and 2-in-1 tablet | The Verge The Fitbit Air takes a smarter approach to the AI health dumpster fire Garmin’s new screen-free fitness tracker doesn’t require a subscription Whoop wants everyone to give a whoop about the new Whoop 5.0 Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
It's time to panic about AI safety
It's a big week for new ideas about computers, so David and Nilay spend some time on Samsung's vision for foldables and Mark Zuckerberg's vision for AI agents that do absolutely everything. Then they talk about the fallout from last week's OpenAI Hugging Face hack, and whether all this talk about AI safety will actually amount to anything. Finally, it's time for Brendan Carr is a Dummy, the vertical video takeover, and the smashing success of the Ferrari Luce. Further reading: Samsung’s Galaxy Z Fold 8 feels like the future Apple launches ‘Upgrade’ program to lease new devices What’s the catch with the Apple Upgrade program? Mark Zuckerberg is planning a big push into personal AI agents Mark Zuckerberg wrote an op-ed about AI for the WSJ. We’re running out of reasons to ignore AI safety OpenAI reportedly didn’t notice its AI agent hacking Hugging Face until a week later. Nvidia, Microsoft launch open AI security alliance — without OpenAI, Google, or Anthropic OpenAI’s rogue AI agent didn’t stop at hacking Hugging Face AI leaders sign a statement asking the government to do something about automated AI Former FCC chairs blast Carr’s early renewal of ABC licenses as an ‘assault on free speech.’ ABC demands FCC drop its ‘punitive’ early license renewal of its stations Qualcomm is raising phone chip prices starting September 1st The Ferrari Luce reportedly already hit its 2026 sales target Samsung’s smartphone biz posts first ever loss, but profit still soars 1,300 percent on RAM. Facebook considers giving up and becoming TikTok YouTube Premium will include Peacock starting next year HBO Max is putting on vertical shorts Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. (Timestamps are approximate.) 00:00:00 Intro 00:03:00 Baby Announcement 00:06:00 Galaxy Z Fold 00:12:00 Apple Leasing Program 00:15:00 Kill Switch Concerns 00:19:00 Zuck Agent Future 00:34:00 AI Safety Week Recap 00:42:00 Regulation Versus China 00:49:00 Winning AI Race 00:53:00 Security Arms Race 00:57:00 Brendan Carr Is a Dummy 01:07:00 Facebook Becomes TikTok 01:12:00 Ramageddon Price Hikes 01:16:00 HBO Max Shorts 01:23:00 Ferrari Luce Buzz 01:26:00 Wrap Up and Plugs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Meta's Oversight Board is coming for ChatGPT and Claude
A new study from the Oversight Board found that leading AI systems are less likely to criticize authoritarian governments than democratic ones. It's a wild finding — but wait? Why is the Oversight Board studying systems from OpenAI and Anthropic in the first place? Suzanne Nossel, who sits on the board, joined us to discuss the findings and why the Oversight Board's future might involve looking at more than just Meta. Further reading: Zoox can now charge for rides in its steering-wheel-free robotaxis Spotify Running Mode helps match tunes to tempo Friend re-launches its AI pendant with a speaker that talks to you, for twice the price How Facebook undercut the Oversight Board Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
The Z Fold 8 is the new foldable to beat
The wide foldable is here, and it's glorious. The Verge's Dominic Preston has been reviewing Samsung's Galaxy Z Fold 8, and joins the show to explain what this shorter, wider device gets right, what it's still missing, and why this looks like the right kind of foldable for most people. (Once the price comes down, anyway.) With a similar foldable iPhone likely coming soon, it's shaping up to be a fun year of foldables. Further reading: OpenAI’s rogue AI agent didn’t stop at hacking Hugging Face | The Verge The US is banning foreign robots | The Verge DoorDash is going airborne with new drone delivery division Willie Nelson is pushing back against data centers in his hometown. Samsung’s Galaxy Z Fold 8 feels like the future Huawei beats Samsung and Apple to market with the first wide foldable A wide foldable iPhone dummy emerges amid rumors of a delay So long, small phones Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Flip phones are so back
The team at Light has been working on minimalist phones for more than a decade. Its last device had a lot in common with a smartphone, but the newest model, the Light Flip, is something very different. Light CEO Kaiwei Tang explains why Light made a flip phone, how the world's opinion of smartphones is changing, and whether you can cure your tech problems with more tech. Further reading: Apple launches ‘Upgrade’ program to lease new devices Apple’s reported ‘HomePad’ may launch as early as October X Money is launching in the US starting today The Light Flip is a minimalist flip phone with a point to prove Light Phone III review: everything in moderation The high hopes of the low-tech phone There’s no perfect minimalist phone — yet Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Here's what an AI-first phone might look like
Some of the biggest players in AI — in particular OpenAI, SpaceX, and Amazon — are heavily invested in creating a world after smartphones. They're also all rumored to be building devices that sound a lot like smartphones. Verge contributor David Imel helps us figure out what these companies might actually be building, what an AI smartphone looks like, and whether anyone can unseat Apple and Google. Links: Elon Musk denies a report about SpaceX’s AI phone prototype OpenAI is reportedly launching a phone for ChatGPT Amazon is making an Alexa phone Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
You can't ignore Google Zero anymore
Google Zero continues to affect website after website, and publisher after publisher. David and Nilay discuss Google's increased focus on AI, the web companies finally starting to fight back, and whether there's a way forward for Google's pact with the open web. After that, they talk about a big week in AI detection software, which sometimes works and frequently doesn't. Then it's time for the Hype Desk, Brendan Carr is a dummy, the Light Flip, and more. Further reading: Google hit with $1 billion fine for breaking EU antitrust rules Reddit might cut ties with Google as traffic drops. From the NYT: How Google’s A.I. Search Is Imperiling the Open Web Google says Gemini now has 950 million monthly users. Google earnings China delivers a one-two punch to America’s AI dominance OpenAI says it accidentally hacked Hugging Face with a new AI system Substack adds an AI detector to help spot blogs written by no one Anthropic’s $1.5 billion book piracy settlement approved by judge Jeff Bezos is getting involved with centering Amazon’s AI in Prime Video Meta made its own AI detection system. It should have just used Google’s Ford picks Apple Maps for its next EV platform and updated BlueCruise Apple’s rumored ‘Upgrade’ program brings lease-to-own pricing for iPhones, Macs, and iPads iOS code could reportedly let Apple cut off apps when users miss iPhone payments Framework’s premium laptop is shipping with less RAM The higher-end prebuilt Framework Laptop 13 Pro now costs $800 more. The Light Flip is a minimalist flip phone with a point to prove Judge pauses Paramount’s attempt to buy Warner Bros. Discovery Paramount’s Warner deal gets conditional approval in the EU. Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed. We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. (Timestamps are approximate.) 00:00:00 Intro 00:01:00 Claude Reads the Meters 00:04:00 Google Zero and Reddit Deal 00:15:00 AI Overviews Death Spiral 00:25:00 OpenAI Hacks Hugging Face 00:32:00 Substack AI Detector Debate 00:39:00 Prime Video Goes All In 00:44:00 Meta Content Seal Cynicism 00:53:00 Avengers Doomsday 01:03:00 Comic Con And Feige Reset 01:04:00 Brendan Carr Is a Dummy 01:12:00 Ramageddon Hits Framework 01:17:00 Apple Leasing Lockdown 01:21:00 Light Flip Phone Trend 01:26:00 Ford Picks Apple Maps 01:35:00 Paramount Merger Mess 01:35:00 Wrap Up And Plugs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Why read anymore?
TikTok is endless. Netflix is already starting the next episode. Who's making time to read a book? Today we're chatting with The Atlantic's Rose Horowitch to discuss her story "The End of Reading is Here" and the role technology plays in reducing how much time — and attention — people have to read long pieces of writing. In a world where we're inundated with more text than ever from social media feeds, AI, and group chats, is it really possible that we're taking in less than before? Further reading: The End of Reading Is Here Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Samsung's next-generation foldables are here | The Vergecast Livestream
Samsung just kicked off phone season with the new Galaxy Z Fold 8, Fold 8 Ultra, and Z Flip 8, along with two new watches and a look at its smart glasses. David and Nilay talk through all the new devices, Samsung's overall case for foldable phones, and what it'll take for Samsung — or anyone — to convince people to spend $2,000 on a phone. Further reading: Samsung’s wider Z Fold 8 feels just right Samsung’s newest foldable finally feels Ultra I almost forgot Samsung’s Z Flip 8 was a foldable Samsung’s Galaxy Watch 9 and Ultra 2 bet big on battery Samsung and Google’s smart glasses get two new designs Subscribe to The Verge for unlimited access to theverge.com, subscriber-exclusive newsletters, and our ad-free podcast feed.We love hearing from you! Email your questions and thoughts to vergecast@theverge.com or call us at 866-VERGE11. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices