A podcast about the automation of everything. Host Jennifer Strong and the team at MIT Technology Review look at what it means to entrust artificial intelligence with our most sensitive decisions.
Welcome to The Extortion Economy
This week we're sharing another tech show we made that we think you're going to love. It's called The Extortion Economy and it's a five-part series about the ransomware epidemic produced with ProPublica. See you soon with a whole new season of In Machines We Trust!! -- A new-age iteration of the old-age extortion problem. A ransomware vigilante, a piracy (as in actual boats) expert, a school administrator, and a kidnapping victim share their experiences. This is part one. We Meet: Fabian Wosar, CTO, Emsisoft Doug Russell, Director of Technology, Haverhill Public Schools Lisa Forte, Co-founder, Red Goat Cyber Security Credits: This series is hosted by Meg Marco and produced by Emma Cillekens, Tate Ryan-Mosley and Anthony Green. It’s inspired by reporting from Renee Dudley and Daniel Golden from ProPublica. We're edited by Bobbie Johnson, Michael Reilly, Mat Honan and Robin Fields. Our mix engineer is Erick Gomez with help from Rebekah Wineman. Our theme music is by Jacob Gorski. Art is from Lisa Larson-Walker and Eric Mongeon. Emma Cillekens is our voice coach. The executive producers of The Extortion Economy podcast are Meg Marco and Jennifer Strong. Sounds From: Video: Colonial Pipeline CEO Joseph Blount testifies at the Senate Homeland Security Committee, Source: CNBC Television, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcYePKjI_mc Video: Roving Report Italy, Source: AP, http://www.aparchive.com/metadata/youtube/8b08bfc68a0b203d238aa8e0c4316e61 Video: CBS Evening News 1989-12-14, Source: CBS, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHsbZEX5pQw
Encore: The AI of the beholder
Computers are ranking the way people look—and the results are influencing the things we do, the posts we see, and the way we think. Ideas about what constitutes “beauty” are complex, subjective, and by no means limited to physical appearances. Elusive though it is, everyone wants more of it. That means big business and increasingly, people harnessing algorithms to create their ideal selves in the digital and, sometimes, physical worlds. In this episode, we explore the popularity of beauty filters, and sit down with someone who’s convinced his software will show you just how to nip and tuck your way to a better life. We meet: Shafee Hassan, Qoves Studio founder Lauren Rhue, Assistant Professor of Information Systems at the Robert H. Smith School of Business Credits: This episode was reported by Tate Ryan-Mosley, and produced by Jennifer Strong, Emma Cillekens, Karen Hao and Anthony Green. We’re edited by Michael Reilly and Bobbie Johnson.
Encore: What’s Behind a Smile
Researchers have spent years trying to crack the mystery of how we express our feelings. Pioneers in the field of emotion detection will tell you the problem is far from solved. But that hasn’t stopped a growing number of companies from claiming their algorithms have cracked the puzzle. In part one of a two-part series on emotion AI, Jennifer Strong and the team at MIT Technology Review explore what emotion AI is, where it is, and what it means. We meet: Rana El Kaliouby, Affectiva Lisa Feldman Barrett, Northeastern University Karen Hao, MIT Technology Review Credits: This episode was reported and produced by Jennifer Strong and Karen Hao, with Tate Ryan-Mosley and Emma Cillekens. We had help from Benji Rosen. We’re edited by Michael Reilly and our theme music is by Jacob Gorski.
Encore: Attention Shoppers, You’re Being Tracked
Cameras in stores aren’t anything new—but these days there are AI brains behind the electric eyes. In some stores, sophisticated systems are tracking customers in almost every imaginable way, from recognizing their faces to gauging their age, their mood, and virtually gussying them up with makeup. The systems rarely ask for people’s permission, and for the most part they don’t have to. In our season 1 finale, we look at the explosion of AI and face recognition technologies in retail spaces, and what it means for the future of shopping. We meet: RetailNext CTO Arun Nair, L'Oreal's Technology Incubator Global VP Guive Balooch, Modiface CEO Parham Aarabi Biometrics pioneer and Chairman of ID4Africa Joseph Atick Credits: This episode was reported and produced by Jennifer Strong, Anthony Green, Tate Ryan-Mosley, Emma Cillekens and Karen Hao. We’re edited by Michael Reilly. Our theme music is by Jacob Gorski.
How AI is giving a woman back her voice
Voice technology is one of the biggest trends in the healthcare space. We look at how it might help care providers and patients, from a woman who is losing her speech, to documenting healthcare records for doctors. But how do you teach AI to learn to communicate more like a human, and will it lead to more efficient machines? We Meet: Kenneth Harper, VP & GM, Healthcare Virtual Assistants and Ambient Clinical Intelligence at Nuance Bob MacDonald, Technical Program Manager, Project Euphonia, Google Julie Cattiau, Project Manager, Project Euphonia, Google Andrea Peet, Project Euphonia user David Peet, Attorney, husband of Andrea Peet Hod Lipson, Professor of Innovation in the Department of Mechanical Engineering; Co-Director, Maker Space Facility, Columbia University. Sounds: The Exam of the Future Has Arrived - via Youtube Credits: This episode was reported and produced by Anthony Green with help from Jennifer Strong and Emma Cillekens. It was edited by Michael Reilly. Our mix engineer is Garret Lang and our theme music is by Jacob Gorski.
What is AI? We made this to help.
Defining what is, or isn’t artificial intelligence can be tricky (or tough). So much so, even the experts get it wrong sometimes. That’s why MIT Technology Review’s Senior AI Editor Karen Hao created a flowchart to explain it all. In this bonus content our host and her team reimagined Hao’s reporting, gamifying it into a radio play. If you would like to see the original reporting visit: https://www.technologyreview.com/2018/11/10/139137/is-this-ai-we-drew-you-a-flowchart-to-work-it-out/ Credits: This episode was reported by Karen Hao. It was adapted for audio and produced by Jennifer Strong and Emma Cillekens. The voices you hear are Emma Cillekens, as well as Eric Mongeon and Kyle Thomas Hemingway. (If you like our show art they made it!) We’re edited by Michael Reilly and Niall Firth.
I Was There When: Facebook put profit over safety
In this episode, we meet Sophie Zhang—a former data scientist at Facebook. Before she was fired, she had become consumed by the task of finding and taking down fake accounts that were being used to sway elections globally. I Was There When is a new oral history project from the In Machines We Trust podcast. It features stories of how breakthroughs and watershed moments in artificial intelligence and computing happened, as told by the people who witnessed them. Credits: This episode was produced by Jennifer Strong, Anthony Green and Emma Cillekens, and edited by Niall Firth and Mat Honan. It’s mixed by Garret Lang, with theme music by Jacob Gorski.
How pricing algorithms learn to collude
Algorithms now determine how much things cost. It’s called dynamic pricing and it adjusts according to current market conditions in order to increase profits. The rise of ecommerce has propelled pricing algorithms into an everyday occurrence—whether you’re shopping on Amazon, booking a flight, hotel or ordering an Uber. We Meet: Lisa Wilkins, UX designer Gabe Smith, chief evangelist, Pricefx Aylin Caliskan, assistant professor, University of Washington Joseph Harrington, professor of business, economics and public policy, University of Pennsylvania Maxime Cohen, Scale AI Chair professor, McGill University Credits: This episode was reported by Anthony Green and produced by Jennifer Strong and Emma Cillekens. We’re edited by Mat Honan and our mix engineer is Garret Lang, with sound design and music by Jacob Gorski.
I Was There When: Facial Recognition was Commercialized
I Was There When is an oral history project that's part of the In Machines We Trust podcast. It features stories of how breakthroughs in artificial intelligence and computing happened, as told by the people who witnessed them. In this first installment we meet Joseph Atick who helped create the first commercially viable facial recognition system. Do you have a story to tell for this series? Do you want to nominate someone who does? We want to hear from you! Please reach out to us at podcasts@technologyreview.com. CREDITS: This episode was produced by Jennifer Strong, Anthony Green and Emma Cillekens with help from Lindsay Muscato. It’s edited by Michael Reilly and Mat Honan, and mixed by Garret Lang, with sound design and music by Jacob Gorski.
How games teach AI to learn for itself
From chess to Jeopardy to e-sports, AI is increasingly beating humans at their own games. But that was never the ultimate goal. In this episode we dig into the symbiotic relationship between games and AI. We meet the big players in the space, and we take a trip to an arcade. We Meet: Julian Togelius Will Douglas-Heaven David Silver David Fahri We Talked To: Julian Togelius Will Douglas-Heaven Karen Hao David Silver David Fahri Natasha Regan Sounds From: Jeopardy 2011-02:The IBM Challenge https://archive.org/details/Jeopardy.2011.02.The.IBM.Challenge/Jeopardy.2011.02.16.The.IBM.Challenge.Day.3.HDTV.XviD-FQM.avi Garry Kasparov VS Deep Blue 1997 6th game (Kasparov Resigns) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsMk1Nbcs-s Attack Like AlphaZero: The Power of the King https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0JK5Fa3AqI Miracle Perfect Anti Mage 16/0 - Dota 2 Pro Gameplay https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59KnNcU9iKc DOTA 2 - ALL GAME-WINNING Moments in The International History (TI1-TI9) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJcNbuASl-Y Credits: This episode was reported by Jennifer Strong and Will Douglas Heaven and produced by Anthony Green, Emma Cillekens and Karen Hao. We’re edited by Niall Firth, Michael Reilly and Mat Honan. Our mix engineer is Garret Lang. Sound design and music by Jacob Gorski.
Beating the AI hiring machines
When it comes to hiring, it’s increasingly becoming an AI’s world, we’re just working in it. In this, the final episode of Season 2, and the conclusion of our series on AI and hiring, we take a look at how AI-based systems are increasingly playing gatekeeper in the hiring process—screening out applicants by the millions, based on little more than what they see in your resume. But we aren’t powerless against the machines. In fact, an increasing number of people and services are designed to help you play by—and in some cases bend—their rules to give you an edge. We Meet: Jamaal Eggleston, Work Readiness Instructor, The HOPE Program Ian Siegel, CEO, ZipRecruiter Sami Mäkeläinen, Head of Strategic Foresight, Telstra Salil Pande, CEO, VMock Gracy Sarkissian, Interim Executive Director, Wasserman Center for Career Development, New York University We Talked To: Jamaal Eggleston, Work Readiness Instructor, The HOPE Program Students and Teachers from The HOPE Program in Brooklyn, NY Jonathan Kestenbaum, Co-founder & Managing Director of Talent Tech Labs Josh Bersin, Global Industry Analyst Brian Kropp, Vice President Research, Gartner Ian Siegel, CEO, ZipRecruiter Sami Mäkeläinen, Head of Strategic Foresight, Telstra Salil Pande, CEO, VMock Kiran Pande, Co-Founder, VMock Gracy Sarkissian, Interim Executive Director, Wasserman Center for Career Development, New York University Sounds From: Curious Thing AI (Sound from their AI tool) HireVue Video Interview: How To Beat The Algorithm and Get The Job: https://youtu.be/jn0dc1cOctA HIREVUE Interview Questions, Tips and Answers! How to PASS a HireVue Interview!: https://youtu.be/ycG5_uccoNk Video Interview Techniques - 3 Easy Hacks To Prepare for Hirevue / Spark Hire / VidCruiter: https://youtu.be/tp0jt4hoHsI How to PASS Psychometric Tests | Tips & Tricks for Aptitude Tests, Numerical Reasoning, Game Based: https://youtu.be/u_nWOnJevaA Credits: This miniseries on hiring was reported by Hilke Schellmann and produced by Jennifer Strong, Emma Cillekens, Anthony Green and Karen Hao. We’re edited by Michael Reilly.
Playing the job market
Increasingly, job seekers need to pass a series of ‘tests’ in the form of artificial intelligence games—just to be seen by a hiring manager. In this third, of a four-part miniseries on AI and hiring, we speak to someone who helped create these tests, we ask who might get left behind in the process and why there isn’t more policy in place. We also try out some of these tools ourselves. We Meet: Matthew Neale, Vice President of Assessment Products, Criteria Corp. Frida Polli, CEO, Pymetrics Henry Claypool, Consultant and former Obama Administration Member, Commission on Long-Term Care Safe Hammad, CTO, Arctic Shores Alexandra Reeve Givens, President and CEO, Center for Democracy and Technology Nathaniel Glasser, Employment Lawyer, Epstein Becker Green Keith Sonderling, Commissioner, Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) We Talked To: Aaron Rieke, Managing Director, Upturn Adam Forman, Employment Lawyer, Epstein Becker Green Brian Kropp, Vice President Research, Gartner Josh Bersin, Research Analyst Jonathan Kestenbaum, Co-Founder and Managing Director, Talent Tech Labs Frank Pasquale, Professor, Brooklyn Law School Patricia (Patti) Sanchez, Employment Manager, MacDonald Training Center Matthew Neale, Vice President of Assessment Products, Criteria Corp. Frida Polli, CEO, pymetrics Henry Claypool, Consultant and former Obama Administration Member, Commission on Long-Term Care Safe Hammad, CTO, Arctic Shores Alexandra Reeve Givens, President and CEO, Center for Democracy and Technology Nathaniel Glasser, Employment Lawyer, Epstein Becker Green Keith Sonderling, Commissioner, Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) Sounds From: *Science 4-Hire, podcast *Matthew Kirkwold’s cover of XTC’s, Complicated Game, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tumM_6YYeXs Credits: This miniseries on hiring was reported by Hilke Schellmann and produced by Jennifer Strong, Emma Cillekens, Anthony Green and Karen Hao. We’re edited by Michael Reilly.
Want a job? The AI will see you now.
In the past, hiring decisions were made by people. Today, some key decisions that lead to whether someone gets a job or not are made by algorithms. The use of AI-based job interviews has increased since the pandemic. As demand increases, so too do questions about whether these algorithms make fair and unbiased hiring decisions, or find the most qualified applicant. In this second episode of a four-part series on AI in hiring, we meet some of the big players making this technology including the CEOs of HireVue and myInterview—and we test some of these tools ourselves. We Meet: Kevin Parker, Chairman & CEO, HireVue Shelton Banks, CEO, re:work Mark Adams, Vice President of North America, Curious Thing AI Benjamin Gillman, Co-Founder and CEO, myInterview Fred Oswald, Psychology Professor, Rice University Suresh Venkatasubramanian, Computer Science Professor, Brown University Clayton Donnelly, industrial-organizational psychologist, myInterview We Talked To: Kevin Parker, Chairman & CEO, HireVue Lindsey Zuloaga, Chief Data Scientist, HireVue Nathan Mondragon, Chief IO Psychologist, HireVue Shelton Banks, CEO, re:work Lisa Feldman Barrett, Psychology Professor, Northeastern University Cathy O’Neil, CEO, O'Neil Risk Consulting & Algorithmic Auditing Mark Adams, Vice President of North America, Curious Thing AI Han Xu, Co-founder & CTO, Curious Thing AI Benjamin Gillman, Co-founder & CEO, myInterview Fred Oswald, Psychology Professor, Rice University Suresh Venkatasubramanian, Computer Science Professor, Brown University Clayton Donnelly, industrial-organizational psychologist, myInterview Mark Gray, Director of People, Proper Christoph Hohenberger, Co-founder and Managing Director, Retorio Derek Mracek, Lead Data Scientist, Yobs Raphael Danilo, Co-founder & CEO, Yobs Jonathan Kestenbaum, Co-founder & Managing Director of Talent Tech Labs Josh Bersin, Global Industry Analyst Students and Teachers from the Hope Program in Brooklyn, NY Henry Claypool, policy expert and former Director of the U.S. Health and Human Services Office on Disability Sounds From: Curious Thing AI myInterview Dolly Parton - 9 To 5: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UbxUSsFXYo4 Arirang News: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30oCHwwLxy4 CBS News: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbRBCU6SHHo CBS Philly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0wiPoCsZFFs Credits: This miniseries on hiring was reported by Hilke Schellmann and produced by Jennifer Strong, Emma Cillekens, Karen Hao and Anthony Green with special thanks to James Wall. We’re edited by Michael Reilly. Art direction by Stephanie Arnett.
Hired by an algorithm
If you’ve applied for a job lately, it’s all but guaranteed that your application was reviewed by software—in most cases, before a human ever laid eyes on it. In this episode, the first in a four-part investigation into automated hiring practices, we speak with the CEOs of ZipRecruiter and Career Builder, and one of the architects of LinkedIn’s algorithmic job-matching system, to explore how AI is increasingly playing matchmaker between job searchers and employers. But while software helps speed up the process of sifting through the job market, algorithms have a history of biasing the opportunities they present to people by gender, race...and in at least one case, whether you played lacrosse in high school. We Meet: Mark Girouard, Attorney, Nilan Johnson Lewis Ian Siegel, CEO, ZipRecruiter John Jersin, former Vice President of Product Management, LinkedIn Irina Novoselsky, CEO, CareerBuilder We Talked To: Mark Girouard, Attorney, Nilan Johnson Lewis Ian Siegel, CEO, ZipRecruiter John Jersin, former Vice President of Product Management, LinkedIn Irina Novoselsky, CEO, CareerBuilder Derek Kan, Vice President of Product Management, Monster Aleksandra Korolova, Assistant Professor of Computer Science, University of Southern California Brian Kropp, Vice President Research, Gartner Matthew Neale, Vice President of Assessment Products, Criteria Corp Josh Bersin, Research Analyst Jonathan Kestenbaum, Co-Founder and Managing Director, Talent Tech Labs Suresh Venkatasubramanian, Assistant Director, White House Office of Science and Technology Policy Sounds From: How to Keep a Job, Coronet Instructional Films: https://archive.org/details/HowtoKee1949 Curious Thing AI (Sound from their AI tool) Credits: This episode was reported by Hilke Schellmann, and produced by Jennifer Strong, Emma Cillekens and Anthony Green with special thanks to Karen Hao. We’re edited by Michael Reilly. Additional reporting from us: https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/06/23/1026825/linkedin-ai-bias-ziprecruiter-monster-artificial-intelligence/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/02/11/1017955/auditors-testing-ai-hiring-algorithms-bias-big-questions-remain/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2021/04/09/1022217/facebook-ad-algorithm-sex-discrimination/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2019/11/07/75194/hirevue-ai-automated-hiring-discrimination-ftc-epic-bias/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/02/14/844765/ai-emotion-recognition-affective-computing-hirevue-regulation-ethics/
When AI becomes childsplay
Despite their popularity with kids, tablets and other connected devices are built on top of systems that weren’t designed for them to easily understand or navigate. Adapting algorithms to interact with a child isn’t without its complications—as no one child is exactly like another. Most recognition algorithms look for patterns and consistency to successfully identify objects. but kids are notoriously inconsistent. In this episode, we examine the relationship AI has with kids. We Meet: Judith Danovitch, associate professor of psychological and brain sciences at the University of Louisville Lisa Anthony, associate professor of computer science at the University of Florida Tanya Basu, MIT Technology Review Credits: This episode was reported and produced by Tanya Basu, Anthony Green, Jennifer Strong, and Emma Cillekens. We’re edited by Michael Reilly.